When To Purchase

[firrae]

Hey there,

 

I have a couple of questions that I've been trying to find answers to but haven't succeeded so far and I hope you can help. I'm really interested in unRAID and it seems to be exactly what I am looking for but I'm curious about my timing in buying it. I'm currently running an i7 4770K (no OC currently) with 32GB of RAM and I'm wondering if I should put unRAID on that system and create a gaming VM like LinusTechTips went through, or if I should wait and do a CPU/Mobo/RAM (to DDR4, likely the same amount) update before installing unRAID?

 

To keep on this like of thought, are there issues doing hardware upgrades after unRAID is installed. I do plan on getting an AMD Threadripper (assuming unRAID and it work together and it doesn't cost as much as a house) or a newer i7 or i9 with more cores (I plan on using VMs and likely lots of Docker containers as I'm a developer) so I'm curious what the process is like upgrading those sorts of components after unRAID has been in place for a little while.

 

Lastly, I do wonder if the idea of making a gaming VM is "recommended" really using unRAID? While Linus showed it's possible and seemingly has minimal impact I do still wonder if LimeTech would say it's an intended solution. I'm not against building a second NAS server, but if I can conjoin both and save money with little gaming performance impact the better.

 

Any help with these questions is greatly appreciated.

[firrae]

To note on this, by VMs and Docker containers I mean I plan on running a PLEX server, media procurement software, as well as smaller, lighter, containers that I make as a test environment. Nothing too major, but it needs to be accounted for I think when looking at the whole usage picture.

[tdallen]

Hello and welcome.

 

It's straightforward to upgrade hardware for unRAID as a NAS and Docker host, including mobo/CPU/RAM replacement.  VMs can be more work, and VMs with hardware pass-through are trickier.  I do not represent Limetech, but I'd say that the gaming VM is a recommended use case, but it's also an enthusiast or expert type option and more leading/bleeding edge than the rock solid NAS functionality.  Not for the faint of heart or people who are looking to "set it and forget it".  You'd have a lot of company, though - lots of people are trying it.

[JonathanM]

1 hour ago, firrae said:

I'm curious about my timing in buying it. I'm currently running an i7 4770K (no OC currently) with 32GB of RAM and I'm wondering if I should put unRAID on that system and create a gaming VM like LinusTechTips went through, or if I should wait and do a CPU/Mobo/RAM (to DDR4, likely the same amount) update before installing unRAID?

I'm not sure what the subtext is of what you are asking, but if you are asking about pricing and future increases, who knows? Prior performance is not a guarantee for the future, but up until now unraid has been price stable for long periods, with adjustments upward after major features were added. However, a license purchased 10 years ago is still valid, no upgrade fees have ever been asked for. Each license tier has only increased in functions and capability, limetech has NEVER reduced the value of a license, or shortchanged previous license holders in any way I'm aware of.

 

So, if you have played with the trial version and it meets your current needs, there is no reason not to purchase now, and if you wait a year or two, it could cost a little bit more. If you purchase now and decide to shelve the project after a bit, remember you can come back to it years later and be pleasantly surprised by the new features and value in your old purchase.

 

DON'T purchase without playing extensively during the trial period, that's what the trial is for, determining whether or not it's worth your time. The money part of the license is tiny compared to the rest of the hardware and time invested.

[Squid]

1 hour ago, firrae said:

Lastly, I do wonder if the idea of making a gaming VM is "recommended" really using unRAID?

A "Gaming VM" is really only a function of the hardware that you give to the VM.  Myself and many others run a VM on unRaid as our primary desktop system.  Mine is 100% rock solid and I have retired my former primary desktop.

[firrae]

50 minutes ago, jonathanm said:

I'm not sure what the subtext is of what you are asking, but if you are asking about pricing and future increases, who knows?

 

I'm more referencing if I should do it pre or post system upgrades. I don't have the money at this time to get a new CPU/mobo/ram, but I do have the drives and can buy the case to house it all in. The cost of unRAID isn't a factor to me, I'm more worried about building the system and then having to wipe everything and restart from scratch when I want to upgrade.

[firrae]

49 minutes ago, Squid said:

A "Gaming VM" is really only a function of the hardware that you give to the VM.  Myself and many others run a VM on unRaid as our primary desktop system.  Mine is 100% rock solid and I have retired my former primary desktop.

I have an existing gaming PC as outlined above, with a GTX 1070, and I'm just trying to think if there is any large downside mainly based on the CPU as I only have 8 threads. I was thinking of doing it and giving the gaming VM the GPU, 16GB of RAM and 4 threads but in my reference was more about it not being an intended use of the feature that might be modified in some future update.

[JonathanM]

2 minutes ago, firrae said:

I'm more referencing if I should do it pre or post system upgrades. I don't have the money at this time to get a new CPU/mobo/ram, but I do have the drives and can buy the case to house it all in. The cost of unRAID isn't a factor to me, I'm more worried about building the system and then having to wipe everything and restart from scratch when I want to upgrade.

Ahh, in that case, moving unraid from one set of hardware to another is no issue at all for the base OS, obviously when you pass through hardware to VM's then things get more complex. Worst case scenario would be rebuilding the VM after you switch, but you may be fine assigning it the new hardware.

 

VM's in unraid are here to stay, the implementation and such may change for the better, with more scenarios and hardware supported.

 

I suggest searching the forum for someone with the same or similar motherboard as you doing a gaming VM, that way you know what to expect.

[firrae]

OK, thanks all. I'll start backing up the stuff I need and I'll look at getting the new case for all the HDDs I want to put in this weekend so I can test out the evaluation version.

[TinkerToyTech]

Few recommendations I will make to you:

 

start out with your DUAL PARITY drives, the pair of Largest drives you are ever planning using as new drives.  I went out and bought a TWO of the MyBookDuo's, because they were the least expensive way to get pair of 8TB drives and an enclosure for WD RED drives.  This gives me my Dual Parity, and in one fell swoop, 16TB MyBook Duo full of my data backed up in one place, where I then sorted out all into their right places, TV, Movies, Music, Backups, et.al together from 10 drives backed off to the second MyBookDuo.  Data All, sorted, old drives precleared (think of preclear as the old Novell CompSurf (Comprehensive Surface analysis) plug the second 16TB in and copy your data to the unraid, further sorting things.  The reason I keep bring up the further sorting thing is I found that over XX years I found my method for logically sorting things had morphed and changed over the decades and now I'm looking at it yet again on each drive? I didn't do too bad, lump 10 drives together? OMG what a flustercluck.  

 

Get your Proper IT Mode Host Bus Adaptor(s):  I would look onEbay first, you might find cards already flashed to IT Mode.  PCI-e8 v2.0 cards for about 60 bucks off Ebay;  PCI-e8 3.0 cards were recently spotted for 99 bucks each (I bought a pair) from NewEgg.

 

 

[SSD]

Dual parity with fewer than about 15 drives is kind of a waste.

 

I'd recommend taking the drive you would have used for dual parity, loading 8T of your most valuable data, and putting it in a safety deposit box (or at a friend or family member's home). That 8T backup with have a much higher likelihood of saving your bacon than dual parity, which although it might sound good, is protection against a very narrow use case.

[firrae]

@TinkerToyTech, I don't think dual parity is really the best option for me, I'm not currently looking for a ton of extra storage (I have 4 HDDs and 3 SSDs I plan on putting in it to start), I just need the storage I do want to be network available and this is probably the cheaper option. By the time I'm at the point of going to 2 parity drives I'll likely have the money to buy 2 separate systems, one NAS and one gaming PC.

@bjp999 I don't plan on using 8TB drives (I have 4 6TB drives right now), but for emergency backups, I plan on using a small application I wrote to back stuff up to Amazon Glacier. on a schedule. Maybe not perfect, but it will work for me.

On another topic, I do have a question about the compatibility of a piece of hardware I was looking at. Maybe this is better suited for the hardware section, but to test everything out I was looking at something like the Thermaltake BlacX (http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-ca/product/thermaltake-thermaltake-blacx-usb-3-0-duet-hdd-docking-station-st0014u-c/10528502.aspx?) to use in testing unRAID out. I can find a use for this after, but it would be a good piece to use to test until I know this is what I really want and then I can spend on getting a bigger chassis and upgrading other hardware.

[JonathanM]

51 minutes ago, firrae said:

to test everything out I was looking at something like the Thermaltake BlacX

While it will probably work, it's definitely not ideal. Many basic drive functions don't translate well across USB interfaces, and there seems to be more of an issue with disconnections and general bandwidth. If you've got another option, like eSATA, that would be better.

[firrae]

21 minutes ago, jonathanm said:

While it will probably work, it's definitely not ideal. Many basic drive functions don't translate well across USB interfaces, and there seems to be more of an issue with disconnections and general bandwidth. If you've got another option, like eSATA, that would be better.

Fair enough, that's what I thought might be an issue. I was trying to find an eSATA version of it or something alike but I haven't found much so far.